FullAuto Posted July 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 26, 2009 Good stuff. Germany's a challenging game if you play historically. The UK's usually safe, but the real challenge is intervening effectively in Europe and holding onto your overseas territories. Can be a bit of a logistical nightmare, too. As France, you can usually give Germany a hard time. Can't wait to see what you do, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 Here's another update. I reloaded my game and on May 21 1943 I declared war on Germany and proceeded to gather all my resources together for a 1-front war. That's right, my Pacific fleet in it's entirety went to the UK along with the Atlantic and Caribbean ships too. So once that was accomplished, I slowly switched from researching ships, planes and industrial topics to a strict regimen of pure unadulterated Infantry (keeping a skeleton crew researching nukes and the occasional secret weapon). In fact, I had 3 separate companies researching the 3 important categories in Infantry for a solid year. Got up to and including the Semi-Modern Infantry, Advanced Airborne and Advanced Marines soldier types. That should be a good start and at least would give me a fighting chance. In the background I was producing these soldiers in a standing order fashion. Once I had a good solid army, I created one unit controlled by a Commando capable of overseeing 20 groups of Marines. This was my primary landing force. Then I created some smaller groups containing mostly infantrymen (all having either AA or Artillary brigade attachments), plus some mixed-bag groups with a HQ, infantry and marines. These would be my land forces. Then I shipped them over to Dover, England, landing there on June 26 1944. While the above was going on, I was doing some heavy shore bombardments on Brest, France from my battleships and aircraft carriers to soften up any targets. I didn't really see much activity there, but I didn't want to take any chances either. My marines landed in Brest on July 1 with no resistance whatsoever - just the way I like it. After they were situated, I split my ships up into two groups: one to bombard the North coast of France, and the other to hit the West. Then I loaded my smaller armies onto a transport and sent them to do an amphibious landing in Rennes, France (which is right next to Brest). That went wonderfully and I ordered my Marines to attack Lorient France (directly under Brest) while the army in Rennes provided a support attack role. All resistance in Lorient was squashed fast. This 2-pronged approach seemed to work pretty good, so I continued on down to the southern coastal provinces in France with my marines leading the charge and armies providing support attacks. Need I mention that my ships were bombarding the coast heavily? Goes without saying. My smaller armies were quietly mopping up the provinces to the East where there was a lot more resistance, but nothing a good old fashioned amphibious attack couldn't fix now and then. Those reinforcements were a big help and allowed me to make my way closer to Germany. Meanwhile the Soviets were making their way West and thus flushing the German troops my way. It was a race to get as much land as possible: Blitzkrieg at it's most hurried state. I think I did ok as my troops now occupied most of France. Then the Soviets convinced Germany to surrender: https://img193.imageshack.us/img193/7226/63996218.th.jpg As you can see from the screen, I was in the process of trying to occupy Amsterdam but it failed due to me being rushed. Oh well. I was also in the process of occupying Belgium, but only managed to get 3 provinces before the Germans surrendered. So here's the state of affairs as it stands right now: https://img36.imageshack.us/img36/2307/32763958.th.jpg I almost got all of France and had it not been for the despicable Soviets mucking around in 3 of the Western provinces, I would have succeeded too. One province in particular (Mulhouse, that area in the light bluish-grey with the tank) was undecided at Germany's surrender and thus was gifted back to France. Yup, France is now one stinking province in size! I also got Essen Germany somehow. Don't really know what happened there, but it's almost like what Berlin turned out to be after WWII: an oasis of strangeness. A side effect of this is that the Soviets annexed Germany which increased their belligerence to a whopping 80! Looksie: https://img188.imageshack.us/img188/1387/26582702.th.jpg Now I'm contemplating whether or not to declare war on them. I have a single nuke, but that's not enough to win a war really. I still have my entire compliment of ships and subs so that's good and I have about 3 strategic bombers (turbojet variety) with a single fighter. That isn't going to help much either. I have a fairly good sized army but I'm guessing it's nowhere near the Soviets size. Tanks are being researched (and built) but those will take time to finish. I don't have any ICBMs either - though the associated research is finished. Here's my conundrum: I think I only have a narrow time frame in which to declare war on the Soviet Union as their belligerence will eventually drop below my intolerance level (does this make sense?). For example, I need a country to have a belligerence level of 50 to declare war on them (currently). Below that, I can't do it. So I either declare war now and hope I can muster enough soldiers and tanks to fight them, or wait until I get more reinforcements and ultimately lose my only chance to gain more territory. Game "victory" is determined by provinces controlled at the end of 1947 and right now the Soviets have 323 while I only have 131. So that means I'm a long way off. Or is victory something different if you don't go after provinces? What I'm trying to say is: is there only one way to win (by having the most provinces) or can a game end properly with a different result? - Zombie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullAuto Posted July 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 It's not the number of provinces that's important, but the number of victory points. If you click on a province, Berlin f'r instance, and look at the province info in the top left, there's a black circle with a white star in it, and the number in the star is how many VPs that province is worth. Europe's a fairly VP-rich area, with capitals being the most obvious ones worth having. You may only have 131 VPs, but how many do the Allies have as a whole? More than 200, I guess? So the gap isn't that big. If you have to go, hit Moscow with that nuke, use your marines and paras to grab ground and your normal infantry to hold it. Don't rely on paras to hold ground, they're not that good at it and are better off jumping out of planes. Liking that invasion of occupied Europe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 It's not the number of provinces that's important, but the number of victory points. If you click on a province, Berlin f'r instance, and look at the province info in the top left, there's a black circle with a white star in it, and the number in the star is how many VPs that province is worth. Europe's a fairly VP-rich area, with capitals being the most obvious ones worth having. You may only have 131 VPs, but how many do the Allies have as a whole? More than 200, I guess? So the gap isn't that big.See, now here's the thing: I'm not an Allied country because I was never invited by the UK to join their stupid exclusive members-only club. Pricks. j/k I'm not an Axis country either. So this is a completely different animal than the usual WWII we are used to. I'm like a 3rd party independent. And we all know what happens to the independents in an established 2-party system, don't we? Here's the breakdown of the top 9 VP countries if that helps: Country VPs Soviet Union 323 United States 131 Japan 122 United Kingdom 121 Italy 68 Vichy France 38 Guangxi Clique 21 Netherlands 20 Australia 20 If you have to go, hit Moscow with that nuke, use your marines and paras to grab ground and your normal infantry to hold it. Don't rely on paras to hold ground, they're not that good at it and are better off jumping out of planes.Can I only load paratroopers onto a plane transport? If I can load other unit types on there, then how are they supposed to get on the ground? Little confused about how I'm supposed to get all those troops down there when most of them can't even tie their shoes, much less jump out of a plane and help fight. I'm also worried that if I attach my only nuke to an ICBM and then send it to Moscow, it'll end up getting shot down by AA just like the 3 nukes I sent to Berlin that time. I have some Strategic Bombers though. Can't I just silently drop it from one of those like the US did to Japan? That should have a better chance of making it through. I don't know how to do this though. Plus, I'm not sure my bombers have enough range to hit Moscow even. - Zombie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullAuto Posted July 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 Only paras can be dropped from planes, yep. I don't think ICBMs can be shot down, but it's been a while. Might want to test that. If you find a close enough airbase (somewhere in Scandinavia?) your strats can drop The Bomb on Moskva no problem, I can't remember if it's a mission type or you add the nuke to the unit like you do with missiles though.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 I tested out the nuke idea and found that I could add it to a strategic bomber. To drop it you just click on the mission type bar and select nuke from the list. Hurray. Dropped it on a province in the Soviet-controlled Germany and did some great damage too. I'm pretty sure that when I tried to nuke Berlin in a test game with an ICBM that it was shot down by either AA or airplanes. Of course, that was a hurried test and I might have been mistaken. Was looking through the pages in the statistics tab last night and found out that I have a huge navy when compared to the Soviets. We both have approximately the same size of air force. But the Soviets have 100 more (groups of) troops than I do. So I don't think that I'd be able to fend them all off should I declare war on them. Oh well. - Zombie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullAuto Posted July 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 I dunno, they won't have all their troops in Europe, and geographically it's quite narrow, (German coast to Switzerland is what 6 provinces? 8?) even further east it's still quite a chokepoint, it isn't until you're into the SU that the territory really opens up. Nuke Moscow, and that gives them a whole world of trouble without you doing anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Just ran a few scouting missions with my strategic bombers into ex-German territory to get an idea of the resistance I might face. It's pretty heavy. I estimate a 3-1 to a 5-1 advantage for them. The Soviets have tanks too - I don't. My worry is that if I nuke Moscow and send troops there, then the land I acquired in France (some provinces are very VP rich) would be at risk. Perhaps by nuking Moscow, that would draw the Soviets' attention away from Europe and to the motherland instead. They probably would send troops back there which would alleviate some of the resistance on the Western front. Then again, I won't know what strategy to use unless I pick one, cross my fingers and prey that I made the right choice. My gut tells me it's a foolish strategy to start a two front war when my troops couldn't possibly hold a single front in France. Remember, I don't have any Paratroopers yet. Nor do I have plane transports or any ICBMs built. Same goes for tanks (but they are slated to be built soon). I'm still unclear about the Moscow invasion strategy you envision though. I get the part of loading paratroopers onto a plane transport and dropping them over the freshly-nuked capital. I get the part of them holding their ground. What I don't understand is how to get my troops into Moscow so that they can hold the ground alongside the paratroopers. I can't fly them in, right? That means I need to try a naval bombardment of the coast to the North of the city, do an amphibious landing with marines, then inject more troops in the captured territory and march them into Moscow. Meanwhile my paratroopers are supposed to hold Moscow all by themselves? Am I missing something? Here's a question I've been meaning to ask for a while: do Marines fight just as effective as normal infantry at the same level in the research tree? Also, do Marines fight good in coastal provinces but suck when they get inland? I'm just wondering because I have a group of them which are pretty far inland right now. They fought well, but they didn't encounter very heavy resistance from the Germans either. Or do they fight just as good as infantrymen except at an amphibious landing where they should excel? - Zombie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullAuto Posted July 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 I'm still unclear about the Moscow invasion strategy you envision though. I get the part of loading paratroopers onto a plane transport and dropping them over the freshly-nuked capital. I get the part of them holding their ground. What I don't understand is how to get my troops into Moscow so that they can hold the ground alongside the paratroopers. I can't fly them in, right? That means I need to try a naval bombardment of the coast to the North of the city, do an amphibious landing with marines, then inject more troops in the captured territory and march them into Moscow. Meanwhile my paratroopers are supposed to hold Moscow all by themselves? Am I missing something? Noooooooooooo! I didn't mean invade Moscow (though re-reading my suggestion that is what it sounded like)! What I meant was, nuke Moscow, and go on the offensive in Western Europe. As soon as the nuke hits, the SU is going to have problems, even if it were at peace and without a massive army to feed, it would still have trouble. Take advantage and attack, the more damage you do the more they will struggle as they'll have to devote more IC to reinforcements. Choose a goal, like a line across Germany from north to south (Wilhelmshafen to Freiburg) or just a province, and go for it. Here's a question I've been meaning to ask for a while: do Marines fight just as effective as normal infantry at the same level in the research tree? Also, do Marines fight good in coastal provinces but suck when they get inland? I'm just wondering because I have a group of them which are pretty far inland right now. They fought well, but they didn't encounter very heavy resistance from the Germans either. Or do they fight just as good as infantrymen except at an amphibious landing where they should excel? Marines are better at amphibious assaults, and fighting in marshes and jungles, than normal infantry. Their organisation and morale are higher, but soft/hard attack values are lower. So in a straight fight, not quite as good, but able to hold their own on the defense against a unit of similar size and tech level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knan Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Marines are, generally, a little worse than normal infantry. Though they are better organized. And they handle mud, river crossings, swamps and jungles better than anything else. They even move faster than others in jungles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullAuto Posted July 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Well, when you saw me last, I was busy invading Germany, and I still bloody am. Bogged down, as I will be for months, by dissent and a correspondingly high TC level, I decided to smack Germany with a rain of ICBMs, and see if that helped any. As the game log shows, it must have stung a little. I got a bit eager and clipped some other Axis countries too. Butterfingers!https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/log.jpg An attack on Berlin with no less than three of my armies (27 divisions) was almost successful, but was foiled by timely Herman reinforcements, leaving my 27 divisions knackered and low on men. Air defense has also grown more savage, as their airspace has shrunk they've got more aggressive (or perhaps it's just because I'm closer to their bases? I dunno. Going to nuke a province somewhere in west Germany if I don't make serious progress soon. The Germans are flying non-stop missions against the Yanks, the focus of them seems to be (from their direction of travel) the American aircraft carriers I've glimpsed off the coast of Europe. There must be some serious air battles going on. Discovered another excellent name while dispersing some forces:https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/mjrbanz.jpg Oh no!https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/italintercept.jpgNot the Italians! Anyone but the Italians! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Thanks for the replies about the Marines vs Infantrymen, guys. That helps a lot. Noooooooooooo! I didn't mean invade Moscow (though re-reading my suggestion that is what it sounded like)! What I meant was, nuke Moscow, and go on the offensive in Western Europe. As soon as the nuke hits, the SU is going to have problems, even if it were at peace and without a massive army to feed, it would still have trouble. Take advantage and attack, the more damage you do the more they will struggle as they'll have to devote more IC to reinforcements. Choose a goal, like a line across Germany from north to south (Wilhelmshafen to Freiburg) or just a province, and go for it.Ah, I see. Well, that's certainly an option I guess. My soldiers probably aren't up for it, but what the heck, no guts, no glory. I'll give 'er a shot and report back. Oh no!https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/italintercept.jpgNot the Italians! Anyone but the Italians!Wha.... !?! Why are the Italians in Germany ('specially in Berlin)? Could you please nuke them for me? Speaking of Berlin, it's a very tough city/province to capture. If I remember my history correctly, the Germans are dug in deep there, much like the French and their Maginot line. I seem to remember reading that Hitler recalled a lot of his airforce to Berlin to bolster it's defenses late in the war as a last-ditch effort. Certainly would explain why it's so tough to take. - Zombie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullAuto Posted July 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Wha.... !?! Why are the Italians in Germany ('specially in Berlin)? Could you please nuke them for me? It might come to that! Germans must be using the Italian air force, I think ze Luftwaffe must be in some state now between me and the Americans. Speaking of Berlin, it's a very tough city/province to capture. If I remember my history correctly, the Germans are dug in deep there, much like the French and their Maginot line. I seem to remember reading that Hitler recalled a lot of his airforce to Berlin to bolster it's defenses late in the war as a last-ditch effort. Certainly would explain why it's so tough to take. Berlin by Antony Beevor is a fantastic book about the battle for the city. Desperate last stands don't work as well in real life (thankfully in this case) as they do in fiction. ------------ I caused severe nipple chafing in Hungary:https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/pecsbomb.jpg Things are still progressing fairly slowly, Germany is now wedged tight between me and them there 'mericans:https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/race2berlin.jpgThis has concentrated their forces to a point where advancing even a single province means focusing several armies on it. Going is easier in the smaller Axis countries, where I've made more progress:https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/inroadsintrom.jpg Romania and Hungary have half a dozen provinces each, Slovakia has one. They'll go down soon. Then I shall push west, to Switzerland, and perhaps then head south, into Italy? I dunno, yet. It's an attractive prospect, but Italy is a long, vulnerable peninsula, sticking out into the entierly Allied Mediterranean. Gobbling up more of Germany would be nice, though. I've thought about using a nuke or two to lessen resistance, but it's not worth it for Hungary/Romania/Slovakia, they're doomed in the very short term. Germany is the most obvious target, somewhere to the west where the Yanks will take over it, Cologne, Frankfurt, Dortmund, Stuttgart etc, but if I end up annexing Germany then I'm going to be the one coping with a nuked province. No chance. That left one obvious target:https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/nukerome.jpgI hope it doesn't create a Mutant Pope. This is a severe kick to the bollocks for Italy, a second-rate power at best. They're going to be curled up in pain for quite a while, so hopefully the Allies will invade. One more prop taken out from under the Axis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Posted August 7, 2009 Report Share Posted August 7, 2009 Yea! I can hear Italy whimpering quietly in a dark corner praying the Pope isn't dead. Can the Vatican fend off a nuclear attack though? I wouldn't put it past them. You've still got some Russian provinces not under Japanese control yet. What's the holdup there? Indifference? Lack of resources in the provinces? Focus on the West instead of the East? Combination of the three? Looks like you literally have millions of troops in your game... - Zombie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorondor Posted August 7, 2009 Report Share Posted August 7, 2009 What's the use of conquest if you can't move up from eating rice to eating pasta in a nice Villa? Not a sip of Italian wine, you say? I smell rebellion brewing amongst the ranks... :: Oh, the glimpse of those green-eyed beauties... You're doomed alright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullAuto Posted August 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2009 You've still got some Russian provinces not under Japanese control yet. What's the holdup there? Indifference? Lack of resources in the provinces? Focus on the West instead of the East? Combination of the three? Looks like you literally have millions of troops in your game... - Zombie The only ones I haven't conquered are empty of resources or have so little it's not worth me conquering them. Every additional province I capture means more of my TC taken up, and the only thing the SU has worth taking really is a couple of provinces with VPs. I'll get around to them eventually. I've got 206 infantry divisions, 5 HQs, 6 cavalry, 4 paras, and 38 garrisons, plus about 80 allied infantry divs. Not that many, really. What's the use of conquest if you can't move up from eating rice to eating pasta in a nice Villa? Not a sip of Italian wine, you say? I smell rebellion brewing amongst the ranks... :: Oh, the glimpse of those green-eyed beauties... You're doomed alright. Oh no, not this little yellow duck. Not for all the Cornettos in Rome (well, none, now). I may nibble at northern Italy, but the peninsula is not for me. I'm hoping the wrinkled Italian grandmother to dusky Italian maiden ratio keeps my troops marching... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Posted August 9, 2009 Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Hehe, keep moving soldiers, nothing to see here except a few wrinkled old grammas. I've got a question about HQ's if I may. Can they get destroyed (urm, killed) in combat? I seem to recall when I played Germany for my first campaign a HQ unit completely disappeared (it was grouped along with about 5 infantry) after an attack. Not sure what happened there, but it took a long while to get a replacement HQ. Also, what goes HQ stand for? "High Quality"? - Zombie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullAuto Posted August 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2009 Oh yes, HeadQuarters can be destroyed. They should never be on the front line, because their purpose is not to fight, but to co-ordinate other units in combat. They increase the combat power and effective supply efficiency of any units in adjacent provinces (increased even more if the officer in charge of the HQ is a general or field marshal with the logistics wizard skill). You don't need very many of them, but they help your units fight better. Any time you have 2-3 (orm ore) armies of 6+ divisions each, get a HQ behind them. They have no problems keeping up, usually. Don't put them in an army, they can't fight for toffee. As an example:https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/hqexamp.jpgThe HQ in Oppeln boosts the units in Breslau, Cracow and Kustrin, and if there were any in Czestochowa or Poznan, those too. Old, but it makes me laugh:https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/Worldwar2RTS.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Old, but it makes me laugh:https://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h109/FullAuto_2006/Worldwar2RTS.gifOld? I've never seen it before. Geez, I just spent about 10 minutes laughing my arse off! Awesome. Thanks! - Zombie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulBrotherKab Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 ^Heh, yeah. That's probably one of the best things I've seen on the interwebz in a long time. New to me as well. BTW, after reading this thread some managed to track down a copy and am getting ready to try my hand at this bad boy. Though it's only the vanilla version. No extending WWII into the 1960s, sadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullAuto Posted August 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Stalin: church help me Churchill: like u helped me before?sure ill just sit here S: dont be an arss C: dont be a commieoops too late Had me in stitches. Enjoy SBK, and if you want to expand the game later on DD/Arma is easily available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulBrotherKab Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Those expansion are completely stand alone, like JA2 Unfinished Business, right? My favorite part is... Roosevelt: thats right ***** im comin for ya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullAuto Posted August 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 One is, one isn't, IIRC. Can't remember which one's which though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knan Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Doomsday's standalone, Armageddon is an addon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulBrotherKab Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Okay, next clarification question! So if I had vanilla HoI2, I could just add on Armageddon to it? Same goes with Doomsday, I gather? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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