Jump to content

Skyranger/APC creation thread


NKF

Recommended Posts

Was just a having a little chuckle recollecting the Mudranger from Morken's screenshot graphic novel from a while back - and remembering the UFO TV series and how they went about clearing the UFO crash zones and sending their SHADO Mobiles in to assault the UFOs (transported to the site on disguised trucks or aircraft).

 

That obviously got me wondering whether something similar can be done in UFO - put in an armoured personnel carrier as the transport for a change of pace. I know we've got graphic replacement mods for walls, scenery, etc. So that would be no problem replacing the actual images.

 

But there are various problems that would be associated with this, and it makes me wonder if it's even possible. So I thought I'd ask those that are in the know if this idea is even feasible.

 

Two things that concern me are the number of graphic tiles that can be used to make up the APC. Are they limited or can then be expanded? I think an APC would be far less elaborate than a Skyranger, but it's stiill good to know what sort of limitations there are. Second, would the MCD records need to be adjusted as well?

 

Third is troop placement - can they be moved about? At least, without having to rely on XComutil? I was hoping such a thing could be made to stand on its own.

 

- NKF

 

Edit by BB: Here's the finished thing!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can't point you to the comic in question as the last image host was very unreliable and the images started vanishing at random. They're all gone now, and I'm not sure what ever happened about finding a new host for them.

 

However, the gist of it was that it was a bit of a spoof screenshot comic and one of the jokes was how the vehicle creators first tried a ground based troop transport (which failed) before settling on the Skyranger. The image used was an old photo of some sort of armoured wheeled vehicle. Might've been an amphibious vehicle, but memory's sketchy at this point.

 

The SHADO Mobiles however are actually a better inspiration. :)

 

- NKF

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, if my issues above aren't a problem, we could even have Viking longboats if we wanted. :)

 

- NKF

 

 

Now THERE'S an amusing image. X-COM craft shoots down a Battleship over the ocean, which then deploys it's experimental 'Insta-raft' floatation device. Several hours later a longboat suddenly bumps into them in the middle of the night; and out jumps the Agents, waving stun sticks over their heads and screaming in Slovakien various 'your mom' insults and wearing Cryssaliyd hides as capes with Ethearl's skulls for helms.

 

 

....No, it's not too early in the morning, why do you ask?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The MCD tables aren't a problem so long as the total tile count doesn't far exceed that of the craft already included in the game. The SkyRanger currently uses the most, clocking in at 65 tiles (26 of which are used for the wings). This could probably be boosted slightly, I've been meaning to audit how many MCD records each tileset requires, but I never got around to it.

 

But anyway, it would take a lot more time to produce the new art required to represent the vehicle then it would to create the new MCD records - if someone were to draw said art, I'd be more then happy to handle the coding required to get it to act as a transport in the Battlescape display.

 

The real technical problem is in getting the thing to act in a realistic manner on the Geoscape. It doesn't understand any vehicles other then those that can fly anywhere and everywhere. A land vehicle, even a submersible one, would have trouble fighting a UFO over water, for eg - but the game wouldn't "know" that, nor would it have any concept of underwater routes being "slower" then land ones.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I already have a concept of what I have in mind on paper. Turning it into the actual image to be used and then cutting all the parts that are not tile-able into their respective tiles would be the most time consuming part. But 65 tiles gives plenty of leeway. Most of it will probably be used up by the front and rear ends. The main body is essentially a box like the one on the Triton.

 

I figured that after watching the UFO series and how SHADO cordons off a crash site after an interception, evacuates all of the civilians with some excuse (say an epidemic or somesuch) and then deploys ground based vehicles for the assault, that it wouldn't be too far fetched if we assume that the Skyranger lands away from the crash zone and then sends an armoured road vehicle out to the scene.

 

Little vehicles like jeeps, pickups, quad bikes, etc would probably fit into the Skyranger as we know it, though an APC type thing might require imagining an expanded Skyranger. I'm thinking of a vehicle at least 3 tiles wide, but not as long as the Skyranger.

 

The viking longboat does not have to make sense. :)

 

- NKF

Link to comment
Share on other sites

*snip*

 

Little vehicles like jeeps, pickups, quad bikes, etc would probably fit into the Skyranger as we know it, though an APC type thing might require imagining an expanded Skyranger. I'm thinking of a vehicle at least 3 tiles wide, but not as long as the Skyranger.

 

The viking longboat does not have to make sense. :)

 

- NKF

 

 

Randomly, I am now picturing a Skyranger buzzing a floating UFO before circling back around and dropping a pair of longboats ala drop-trooper style (Like at the start of Halo 2?) ;):)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

https://ufoseries.com/computerGraphics/mobileDriveway.jpg

 

Something like that? You could probably do it with fewer tiles than the Skyranger so long as you don't get too complex with the graphics, 3 tiles for the track on the visible side, 1 for each wall, 1 for each corner, 2 for the ramp, 2-4 for the cab, 1 tile repeated for the roof, etc. Maybe just fill in the parts on the first floor with a copy of the other track if you are low on tiles.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Definitely lesser tiles than the Skyranger. Bomb Bloke did mention that a large part of tile that make up the Skyranger are for the wings. The central part is just going to be a plain box, so isn't going to need too much effort. The most elaborate parts of the vehicle will be the front and ramp section. And if there are plenty of tiles left over, then we can go wild and add detail - like access panels, storage/ammo crates, pick axes, shoves, rocket launchers, tent rolls strapped to the outside, etc.

 

I was puzzling over one thing. Since it's going to be a low 1 tile high vehicle (2 if you count the upper level roof detail), the floor inside of the tank is going to be below the axles. Perhaps it will need a bit of visual trickery to work.

 

Since it's the weekend, I might try and get my idea off paper and see if I can translate it into an actual working image. Will leave the cutting up for later. You've got to praise the concept of layers that are used in many graphic editing program these days. Great for fitting things together without destroying the actual images.

 

- NKF

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Have the visible track beside the interior with the outer wall sloping over to an edge, with the roof meeting it there. On the interior floor, have a slight elevation, maybe a couple of pixels high if that's possible (similar to the Avenger roof).
Link to comment
Share on other sites

In order to implement a new craft, it must effectively replace an old one. Having it carried in/under the SkyRanger solves this issue near perfectly, both from technical and "gameplay" perspectives. The one point where it remains complex is troop placements. These can't be remapped via RMP files (like they can for aliens in their UFOs) - they're handled by the GeoScape executable.

 

One way to deal with this is to just design the new map in such a way that the solders can be placed exactly as they would be in a SkyRanger - hence there would be no incompatibility. The problem with this is that it limits creativity (eg, you wouldn't be able to pull the trick Jman mentioned above, re placing the floor mid-level - which, by the way, is perfectly viable otherwise).

 

Another method is to have an extra executable running between the Geoscape/Tactical engines, that manually detects when the alternate transport is in use, and moves the troopers to their desired locations. This would be trivial for me to code as an extension to my current mod-pack, or even as an extension for use with XcomUtil's addon system (keeping in mind that my modpack can be used as an extension to XCU anyway), but in order to use the map in this way the game would need to be executed either through my modpack, via XcomUtil, or via it's own special stand-alone loader.

 

The third and final option would be executable editing, so that the GeoScape engine adapts it's troop placement methods to match your new map. Seb should be able to add such a thing to his loader, but whether he'd be able to commit time to this is something I can't say. The downside to this method is that it becomes pretty much impossible to have the mod compatible with all versions of the game.

 

Just something for you to think about.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The first option would certainly be very limiting, or at least result in a tank that is two levels high. Would solve the floor/axle problem, but it would be a very big tank. Hmm. A Griffon AFV adapted to carrying troops? Nah both silly and would need too many unique tiles.

 

The executable that kicks in between the Geoscape and Tactical by way of an XComutil plugin or as a separate loader sounds like the most flexible option, and it would be easy to make compatible with other mods (with the possible exception of Xcomutil's interceptor dropship - unless that were redone as well).

 

- NKF

Link to comment
Share on other sites

(with the possible exception of Xcomutil's interceptor dropship - unless that were redone as well).

I'm somewhat confused by this, there should be no problems - unless you intend to replace THAT with a APC as well? Though I really can't bring myself to accept the idea of an Interceptor carrying around such a thing...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Me neither, but I'm pretty sure someone might want to use it, and since it borrows the Skyranger graphics, replacing the Skyranger graphics with an APC would mess it up.

 

Mind you, a proper 'interceptor'- ala the intro, now that might be worth considering. But I'm concentrating on the APC for now. Didn't realize how tough it is was to just block out a silhouette of the right shape (for the walls) in the iso view.

 

- NKF

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Me neither, but I'm pretty sure someone might want to use it, and since it borrows the Skyranger graphics, replacing the Skyranger graphics with an APC would mess it up.

Ah! Don't worry about that; it's an easy enough problem to avoid.

 

Didn't realize how tough it is was to just block out a silhouette of the right shape (for the walls) in the iso view.

Not that I know much about pixel art, but if I were gonna do it, I'd consider creating a 3D model first then drawing over the top of it: sorta like tracing over a template.

 

One way to do THAT would be to edit the pre-existing SkyRanger MCD file's LOFTemps entries, then using my "LOF Terrain" tool to represent the result graphically within, say, Daishiva's MapView - like this.

 

Though I admit that might be a bit complex... :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A snap of my working canvas so far.

 

sample.png

 

Slow progress, but getting there. Don't mind the overlays - they were just guides. Just blocking out the shape at the moment.

 

The details like what sort of APC, propulsion, colour scheme, etc will have to come later. In fact, I had an overload of possibilities on how it could look that I ended up wasting too much time. Hence why I'm just defining the basic shape of the front section for now. Tile-by-tile.

 

Overall the front, being the most detailed portion of the APC will need 10 tiles at the very least (have done 8). And it appears that I may have plenty of room to 'fake' the actual position of the axles without having to raise the interior.

 

This is definitely going to require a re-imaging of the transport for the Ufopaedia :)

 

- NKF

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Three more far tiles generated. Took a cleaner shot with most of the guides hidden, and did a mockup of the central block by tiling a basic floor and the midsection's near and far walls.

 

sample2.png

 

The interior is only 3 tiles wide, but it actually looks a lot more spacious than it really is. I'll need to fill the space a little. Probably not that seat, but may go for paneling of some sort.

 

So far only 13 tiles used. 14 if we pretend there's a red flat roof. Only the rear end needed to complete the basic shape. Think there's going to be plenty of room to customize the appearance once I actually get round to painting the tiles.

 

- NKF

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If the APC doesn't have the same troop/HWP capacity as the craft it's replacing, then we'll need to go into executable editing territory. Re-arranging where the units are placed is one thing, but actually changing the headcount is another... :)
Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, same headcount, though may end up with a bit more leg room depending on how long the APC is when it is complete. Actually been thinking of utilizing some of the space for a ramp to allow roof access. Maybe via a turret well or a hatch.

 

One last screen cap before I call it a night. Cleaned up a bit, implemented the tracks and completed the rear end. About 17 - 18 tiles used in total.

 

 

sample3.png

 

Just realized after I attached this that the mock-up centre block for the APC is one length too long. But that's roughly it for the core of the tiles. Now I can start thinking about visual features like what colours to use, hatches, lights, containers, thingamibobs, panel seams, decals (X-Com insignia), etc, etc, etc.

 

- NKF

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Did a little more work over the weekend, detailing the sides of the front of the tank. Decided to go with the HWP scheme for simplicity, and since X-Com uses it a lot.

 

sample4.png

 

The shiny plate thingy in front is not really a shiny plate. It's unfinished as I'm not entirely sure what to put in there.

 

I'm wondering if I should move the armoured cockpit to the middle of the tank?

 

- NKF

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Reckon the hatch looks fine where it is. Regarding the plate, the only thing I can think of to stick there would be a winch, perhaps.

 

One thing that's always bugged me about the standard set of craft is the danger in exiting out the back - the enemy to the sides can shoot at you before you even get a chance to see them. It's arguably the way most soldiers meet their ends.

 

Since there's no space underneath the APC, it provides slightly more cover then usual, but perhaps railings along the sides of the ramp would provide some extra cover while still allowing your soldiers to turn and fire on attackers.

 

A way to "properly" see out of the sides mightn't hurt, either. With the usual dropships, the only reason you can do this is due to slight gaps between the roof, the walls, and the flooring - the angles involved don't allow you to see any nearby aliens. Some windows would allow you to do some "proper" scouting, or perhaps even give you a chance to shoot anything too close to the ramp. The downside to this is that the aliens could shoot into the vehicle.

 

Moving into the realm of "outright cheating", you could also place side entry/exit points near the front, covered with "bulletproof" curtains that you can't see/fire through, but can walk through (basically the same as the door to the Lightning craft, which doesn't act much like a door at all).

 

All just suggestions, of course, and I dunno how you feel about using this thing to get tactical advantages. But if I were a commander, I'd have enough weaponry built in to take out everything in sight well before any of my solders had to step out of it... :cool:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
  • Create New...