Migrant crisis


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#1 silencer_pl

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Posted 14 August 2015 - 03:35 PM


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#2 Space Voyager

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Posted 16 August 2015 - 01:38 PM

Silencer, what you are seeing is a result of centuries of exploitation and utter desperation that these people live in. I don't have the time to go deep about this immigrant stuff, but you WILL NOT be writting such comments about people.

#3 silencer_pl

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Posted 16 August 2015 - 01:48 PM

Let me see, they come un-invited, they receive free food, free cloths, and a place to live and then they just trash everything? And you call it desperation? Hello, wake up please. Did you even watch this? This is not how normal people behave.
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#4 Space Voyager

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Posted 16 August 2015 - 04:01 PM

They are not normal. They are abnormally dehumanized by the state they lived in. Which is in good part the result of the crap the so called West did to their countries and is funding it still.

They are risking EVERYthing. They have nothing to lose. And they are being treated like cattle.

You shouldn't judge their actions without looking at the bigger picture.

#5 silencer_pl

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Posted 16 August 2015 - 04:11 PM

That still doesn't give them any right to come here and devastate everything. And no, they are not risking everything, they are going the easy route. Instead of fighting for their country and homes, they just go to Europe demanding that we should bow to them. The west might took part in their destruction, but they also are ones to blame too. They allowed it to happen.
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#6 Space Voyager

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Posted 17 August 2015 - 08:39 AM

Root cause for migrant crisis.

Another article on causes.

Silencer... GOING THE EASY ROUTE?!?!!?!?!?!?!? I'm not even going to comment.

#7 silencer_pl

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Posted 17 August 2015 - 09:57 AM

Well then go ahead invite them to your home. Feed them, give them your money, your possessions. I'm sure they will be grateful enough and will leave something for you.

http://www.frontpage...niel-greenfield

I don't care if they have lost a country. My country was wiped out from the map few times and yet we didn't came to kill rape and murder in whole Europe. We also were sold as slave by our "gracious" allies.

Sweeden has already fallen, thanks to your "poor" immigrants.

http://www.telegraph...p-in-smoke.html

And I'm sure you want to say to this girl: "Don't worry it's just the way they say hello"

http://majorityright...wave_in_sweden/

Oh and the only true immigrants are already dead:

http://edition.cnn.c...rown-overboard/

Now say, "Thank you, Uncle Sam, for killing Kaddafi and Hussein"

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Posted 29 December 2015 - 01:03 AM

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Let me see, they come un-invited, they receive free food, free cloths, and a place to live and then they just trash everything?

This is called being a drama queen. You might want to tone down the hyperbole.  Trash everything?  Everything?  I've seen worse on a Friday night.

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devastate everything.

Hyperbole.  Next you'll be comparing them to swarms of locusts.

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Sweeden has already fallen, thanks to your "poor" immigrants.

You'll find it's still there.  The 'rape wave' in Sweden, for instance, is down to the Swedish criminal definition and crime statistics methods (as mentioned in the lead here: https://en.wikipedia.../Rape_in_Sweden).

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they are going the easy route.

You haven't taken that journey yourself, or any comparable one, I suspect, so you have no idea what you are talking about.

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Instead of fighting for their country and homes

The funny thing is if you look at the countries in question and the migrants, you'll find that the countries simply cannot house, feed, arm and train such huge numbers of people.  So if every single migrant returned, willing to fight, they would be unable to.  Their numbers are often many many times the size of the armed forces of the country in question.  Don't let a little thing like logistics get in the way of your ranting though.

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they just go to Europe demanding that we should bow to them.

Who has gone to Europe and demanded you to bow to them? No-one has. No-one has demanded I bow to them either. Anyone else?  This is simply far-right rhetoric.  I know it from the EDL/BNP/BF and several others in the UK, and I know Poland has problems with neo-Nazism too, so it doesn't surprise me to find such vitriol espoused online.

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The west might took part in their destruction, but they also are ones to blame too. They allowed it to happen.

You make such grand sweeping statements, made possible by your very lack of understanding.  Syrians allowed the West to bomb their own country?  The fiends! So cunning!

I also note some of your links are, quite frankly, from sites that have an unerring interest in Nationalism and ethnic genetics. Oh dear.  Nazism rears its ugly head once again.  How very sad.

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#9 silencer_pl

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Posted 29 December 2015 - 06:32 AM

It's funny how simply you make Nationalism and Nazism as equal. Also, where does Poland has problem with neo-Nazism? Last I've heard neo-Nazism is doing fine in Germany.

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Hyperbole.  Next you'll be comparing them to swarms of locusts.

What hyperbole, just take a look of what has happened.

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You'll find it's still there.

Sure and with it, lots of Shariah zones, were even the police is afraid to enter. Sweden is dying.
http://swedenreport....ones-in-sweden/

It's funny how people who never endured communism and socialism, are so happy with it, yet they don't see how it ruins their country from inside. And how funny is that all the leftists suddenly now call any people who wants their country safe, Nazis.

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You haven't taken that journey yourself, or any comparable one, I suspect, so you have no idea what you are talking about.

What do you know? Enlighten me about my life please. Everything I have now, I earned through hard work and not through vegetation of your glorious socialism comrade.

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The funny thing is if you look at the countries in question and the migrants, you'll find that the countries simply cannot house, feed, arm and train such huge numbers of people.  So if every single migrant returned, willing to fight, they would be unable to.  Their numbers are often many many times the size of the armed forces of the country in question.  Don't let a little thing like logistics get in the way of your ranting though.

Saudi Arabia such poor, no money, no help for brothers in faith.
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Posted 29 December 2015 - 07:34 AM

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It's funny how simply you make Nationalism and Nazism as equal.

Because Nazism incorporates nationalism? Again, you would know this if you knew anything about history.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism

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Also, where does Poland has problem with neo-Nazism?

Do you mean apart from your rhetoric?  Little things like this: http://www.bbc.co.uk...ism_proble.html, http://www.ft.com/cm...l#axzz3vgtOGMm8, http://www.ft.com/cm...l#axzz3vgtOGMm8 and so on and so forth. It's probably too soon for Poland to go back to carrying out actual Jewish pogroms seeing as how you don't have actual Nazis on hand to help you this time, but I imagine Muslims will do in a pinch.

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Sweden is dying.

Your extensive knowledge backed up there by a far-right blog. Cool story. Can I just point out here that Sweden has a higher GDP per capita, a higher Human Development Index, a lower Gini coefficient, higher life expectancy, and generally every other quality of life metric I could find is better than Poland's.  But Sweden is dying.  Got it.

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Things really kicked off in January, when there was a guy on Fox News that made the ludicrus claim the entire city of Birmingham, the second largest in the UK, was a shariah-controlled No-Go Zone for non-muslims. He has since issued a public retraction and apology.

LOL.  What a surprise. Right-wing loony tunes turn out to be a bunch of lies. I'm sure that's never happened before or since.  I'm sure every other piece of nonsense you post will be similarly rock-solid in terms of facts.

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It's funny how people who never endured communism and socialism, are so happy with it, yet they don't see how it ruins their country from inside

This doesn't make sense. They never endured communism or socialism...but they're happy with it...even as it ruins their country from the inside?  So, they live in a communist/socialist country, and they're happy, but they've never lived in a communist/socialist country? Even you must realise that's impossible?

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And how funny is that all the leftists suddenly now call any people who wants their country safe, Nazis.

If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck...

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What do you know? Enlighten me about my life please.

I know you're a far-right racist, is that enlightening enough?

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Everything I have now, I earned through hard work and not through vegetation of your glorious socialism comrade.

How could you earn things through my socialist vegetation? Again, this doesn't make sense.

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Saudi Arabia such poor, no money, no help for brothers in faith.

You didn't even get the meme right.  Key to Doge grammar are the core five: such, very, many, so, and much; and the exclamation “wow”.  And again, you show your ignorance and racism, assuming all Muslims are the same. Like any religion, Islam has different denominations, and those denominations do not always see eye-to-eye.

Throughout your post you have done nothing but avoid my questions, dissemble, present fallacies, and merely try to divert the subject ("What about Germany, they have neo-Nazis!  What about Saudi Arabia, they are Muslims!"), presenting links from far-right organisations like it's no big deal.  Will you slip up one day and present a link from Stormfront?  Will it even be a slip up?

The secret Muslim conspiracy to destroy the West with halal food continues, no doubt, if only in your own head.

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#11 Space Voyager

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Posted 29 December 2015 - 07:45 AM

All right, THE FIRING RANGE!!! Posted Image

Still, try to stay away from personal insults, there are more than enough insulting arguments to throw around.

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Posted 29 December 2015 - 08:29 AM

Is it a personal insult to call a person a bigot if they are bigoted?

View Postsilencer_pl, on 14 August 2015 - 03:35 PM, said:



This video, by the way, has nothing to do with the migrant crisis. It's to do with the violence that followed this: https://en.wikipedia...lturno_massacre

I wish I could say I was shocked that it was put forward falsely, but I am not.

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#13 silencer_pl

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Posted 29 December 2015 - 09:29 AM

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Because Nazism incorporates nationalism? Again, you would know this if you knew anything about history.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism

I'm against socialism, yet nazism has socialism in it's definition and you call me Nazi. I'm also pro capitalism which Nazis oppose. Cool story bro.

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Do you mean apart from your rhetoric?  Little things like this: http://www.bbc.co.uk...ism_proble.html, http://www.ft.com/cm...l#axzz3vgtOGMm8, http://www.ft.com/cm...l#axzz3vgtOGMm8 and so on and so forth. It's probably too soon for Poland to go back to carrying out actual Jewish pogroms seeing as how you don't have actual Nazis on hand to help you this time, but I imagine Muslims will do in a pinch.

Since when hooligans are the prime representatives? And maybe you will tell me that football fans in England are peaceful bunch, that go drink beer and shake hands?

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It's probably too soon for Poland to go back to carrying out actual Jewish pogroms seeing as how you don't have actual Nazis on hand to help you this time, but I imagine Muslims will do in a pinch.

Wow, are you that indoctrinated by leftist propaganda? And maybe you believe that there was not Nazi death camps but Polish death camps? If so, go get a brain and read some history books. Maybe it was Poland who murdered all the Jews. How about I tell you that there were many Jews in the SS. How about I tell you that Jews also committed mass murders on other Jews? Or how about I tell you that plenty of Jews that survived the war, eagerly joined the communist political machine, sentencing many people to death, even those who helped them survive? Of course your leftist propaganda will deny everything and you will eat it like everyday morning bullshit.

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LOL.  What a surprise. Right-wing loony tunes turn out to be a bunch of lies. I'm sure that's never happened before or since.  I'm sure every other piece of nonsense you post will be similarly rock-solid in terms of facts.

Wow, one guy makes a mistake and suddenly every one is a loony. Of course you will also deny any Muslim Patrol in UK and there was never "Britsh Police can go to hell" and such.

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So, they live in a communist/socialist country, and they're happy, but they've never lived in a communist/socialist country? Even you must realise that's impossible?

Maybe if you would look sometimes from other side of the mirror you would see. Your cheerful bubble will burst and it will hurt you badly.

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Your extensive knowledge backed up there by a far-right blog. Cool story. Can I just point out here that Sweden has a higher GDP per capita, a higher Human Development Index, a lower Gini coefficient, higher life expectancy, and generally every other quality of life metric I could find is better than Poland's.  But Sweden is dying.  Got it.

Oh, oh, please compare a country not devastated by WW2, then by Stalinizm and Communism to a country that was. I applaud you so much.

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I know you're a far-right racist, is that enlightening enough?

Cool story bro. Please tell me more.  

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How could you earn things through my socialist vegetation? Again, this doesn't make sense.

If you don't know how socialism works, why are we having this conversation anyway?

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You didn't even get the meme right.  Key to Doge grammar are the core five: such, very, many, so, and much; and the exclamation “wow”.  And again, you show your ignorance and racism, assuming all Muslims are the same. Like any religion, Islam has different denominations, and those denominations do not always see eye-to-eye.

I was not aiming for for Doge meme. Not everyone can understand sarcasm.

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Throughout your post you have done nothing but avoid my questions, dissemble, present fallacies, and merely try to divert the subject ("What about Germany, they have neo-Nazis!  What about Saudi Arabia, they are Muslims!"), presenting links from far-right organisations like it's no big deal.  Will you slip up one day and present a link from Stormfront?  Will it even be a slip up?

Questions are followed by a question mark symbol ? you know?

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#14 FullAuto

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Posted 29 December 2015 - 01:54 PM

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I'm against socialism, yet nazism has socialism in it's definition and you call me Nazi.

I never called you a Nazi. I said "neo-Nazi". There is a difference. Not that you seem to be able to grasp that.

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Since when hooligans are the prime representatives? And maybe you will tell me that football fans in England are peaceful bunch, that go drink beer and shake hands?

This is what we call a digression. You use it a lot when someone has made a good point which you have no answer to. You either bring up others associated with the same subject, or attempt to reflect the statement back at the originator. Although it works when someone is very polite, because they attempt to follow the digression, it doesn't work when someone refuses to be distracted.

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Of course your leftist propaganda will deny everything and you will eat it like everyday morning bullshit.

You eat bullshit in the morning? Is that a thing in Poland? Quite frankly, I'm just glad you're not a Holocaust denier.

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Wow, one guy makes a mistake and suddenly every one is a loony.

Not everyone (that's your hyperbole kicking in again). Just right-wing loonies and those who believe everything they read on right-wing sites and blogs.

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Of course you will also deny any Muslim Patrol in UK and there was never "Britsh Police can go to hell" and such.

No. Wrong. It happened in the UK. Once.  https://en.wikipedia...ia_patrols  One swallow does not a summer make.

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Maybe if you would look sometimes from other side of the mirror you would see. Your cheerful bubble will burst and it will hurt you badly.

You cannot actually look from the other side of a mirror, unless it is a one-way mirror. My point was that your example was impossible. If you live under communism/socialism, and it is rotting your country, but you are happy, and you have never experienced communism/socialsm...do you see that what you have said is impossible?  If you live in a communist/socialist country, then you will have experienced it.  Do you want to apologise for your miscommunication and re-phrase it for clarity, or do you just wish to double down on every stupid thing you have said so far including literal impossibilities.

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Oh, oh, please compare a country not devastated by WW2, then by Stalinizm and Communism to a country that was. I applaud you so much.

Can you hear that?  It's the world's smallest violin.  And it's playing just for you.

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Cool story bro. Please tell me more.

I don't need to. Your lack of denial tells me all I need to know.

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If you don't know how socialism works, why are we having this conversation anyway?

But I do. My point was, why do you expect to earn things from my socialist vegetation?

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I was not aiming for for Doge meme.

Of course you weren't.  Good save.

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Questions are followed by a question mark symbol ? you know?

How odd then, that you can recognize the symbol, and know what it means, yet fail to give a straight answer to any question put to you.  It's almost like you're avoiding them.  Do you honestly think such childish tactics go unnoticed?  You're quite welcome, for instance, to answer the questions I have asked you, but instead no, more silliness.  Even the knowledge that the video that prompted you to start spreading nonsense is nothing to do with the current migrant crisis doesn't faze you.  Why would it?  You don't care if it's true or not, merely that it confirms what you think you know.  How very sad.

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#15 Hobbes

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Posted 29 December 2015 - 02:33 PM

View Postsilencer_pl, on 29 December 2015 - 06:32 AM, said:

It's funny how simply you make Nationalism and Nazism as equal. Also, where does Poland has problem with neo-Nazism? Last I've heard neo-Nazism is doing fine in Germany.

I don't know about how it is in Poland right now, but in August 1996 I was travelling through Europe by rail with a couple of friends and we got attacked by 10 skinheads in the main street of Gdansk because one of my friends was half-Indian and he ended up in the hospital, and none of the bystanders on the street cared about it, plus another incident in a bar in Warsaw where we were advised to leave the place because some clients didn't like how we looked and were throwing pieces of broken glasses at us.

Despite the experience I don't consider all Poles to be racist bigots, the same way I don't consider all migrants to be rapists or thieves. There are bad apples everywhere, and most folks in the world are decent folks. The problem is when the bad ones get too much media attention because: a) horror stories sell more; and b) amplifying and distorting those stories fills the extreme right's agenda.
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#16 silencer_pl

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Posted 29 December 2015 - 03:30 PM

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I never called you a Nazi. I said "neo-Nazi". There is a difference. Not that you seem to be able to grasp that.

Let's see

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Neo-Nazism borrows elements from Nazi doctrine, including ultranationalism, racism, ableism, xenophobia, homophobia, antiziganism, antisemitism

Ultranationalism - wrong I'm far away from that.
Racism, antiziganism - wrong I only hate people who only abuse social rights to get money for doing nothing, free housing, etc. Facts are that many gypsies do not work, nor do not want to work, yet our communist/socialists forced them to integrate, and we still spend lots of money on them. Only few are worth respect. USA also has this problem with Mexicans, Puerto Ricans and black people. Tell me why when for example Detroit when had 80% / 20% ratio of white - black population was thriving and suddenly when the proportions changed, the city started to fall?

Ableism - nope don't have anything against such people.
Xenophobia - nope wrong.
Homophobia - The only problem is and many normal homosexuals despise LGBT movement, same as many women despise Femi-Nazis. I don't care where you stick your cock in. And you don't have to show me in and extort on me to like it. Screaming tolerance, yet they show non, that I may not like what they are doing.
Antisemitism - normal Jews are ok people, but there are those who just live on calling everyone Jew hater. Like they are any better or something. Other nations suffered too you know?

So yeah, you've missed quite a long from me being neo-Nazi.

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Just right-wing loonies and those who believe everything they read on right-wing sites and blogs.

Same thing can be said about those from the left side.

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No. Wrong. It happened in the UK. Once.  https://en.wikipedia...ia_patrols  One swallow does not a summer make.

And there is this soldier who loses his head, then there are protests in some schools from muslisms, that white kids should not be allowed.

There is also this: http://www.barenaked...of-the-country/
Happy people I see.

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But I do. My point was, why do you expect to earn things from my socialist vegetation?

I suggest re-read my initial point. The point is, that people can abuse socialism, get money for doing nothing and live until they die, and you will pay for their live. How would you feel, that someone gets more money than you earn for doing nothing, while you work hard to get what you have? And that's what majority of migrants from Muslim countries are doing. Their wives are baby makers only, maybe 1-2 people work from the entire 10 people family.

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Of course you weren't.  Good save.
Because only your word counts I see?

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I don't know about how it is in Poland right now, but in August 1996 I was travelling through Europe by rail with a couple of friends and we got attacked by 10 skinheads in the main street of Gdansk because one of my friends was half-Indian and he ended up in the hospital, and none of the bystanders on the street cared about it, plus another incident in a bar in Warsaw where we were advised to leave the place because some clients didn't like how we looked and were throwing pieces of broken glasses at us.

Despite the experience I don't consider all Poles to be racist bigots, the same way I don't consider all migrants to be rapists or thieves. There are bad apples everywhere, and most folks in the world are decent folks. The problem is when the bad ones get too much media attention because: a) horror stories sell more; and b) amplifying and distorting those stories fills the extreme right's agenda.

Yes back in those years, things might looked more grim. But such situations could happen anywhere in the world. Things are currently quite better.
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Posted 30 December 2015 - 06:40 PM

The video you showed is a lie.  You don't care, because you're not looking for facts, but excuses.  It took me all of five minutes on Google to find out where it was really from and what it was about.  You accepted it unquestioningly because it confirms your prejudices.

The Polish armed forces fell apart when the Germans invaded. Why didn't they fight harder?  Why did thousands of them leave Poland to go to France and then the UK? Why didn't they stay and fight?  Why didn't the Poles resist the USSR effectively?  Why are there thousands of Polish immigrants coming to my country now? What's wrong with Poland?

The secret is: there are perfectly good answers to these questions. Just as there are perfectly good answers for why there are refugees fleeing to Europe now. The difference is, you will go out of your way to make excuses for Poles, but not for people of another colour or religion. According to you, it's perfectly fine for a Pole to come to my country to make money, but it's not okay for a Syrian to flee to your country, or my country, or another European country, because of war.  That attitude really is beyond the pale.  Your issues are not about immigration, but race.  See here:

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Tell me why when for example Detroit when had 80% / 20% ratio of white - black population was thriving and suddenly when the proportions changed, the city started to fall?

Unless you somehow think Detroit (at this magic unspecified time and strangely convenient population percentage) suddenly suffered a massive influx of Puerto Rican immigrants, your question is one of race.

Here's some hilarious facts you didn't know because you believe everything you're told as long as it's racist garbage:

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From at least 1880 to the 1980s, the greatest number of immigrants living in Wayne County, Michigan (where Detroit is located) were from Central and Eastern Europe.

Where's Poland again?

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After the passage of laws restricting immigration to the U.S. in the 1920s and the later internal migration out of Detroit, the percentage of immigrants among Detroit's total population consistently fell until 1990, by which point immigrants composed less than five percent of Detroit's total population.

So it's fair to say that the decline of Detroit, unless you somehow think it began in the 19th century, is not linked to immigrants and immigration, but your real concern: race.  https://en.wikipedia...tory_of_Detroit - this is child-level stuff.  Here's another article, https://en.wikipedia...line_of_Detroit which you really should have read.  But then you would be forced to admit the decline of an entire city was not down to the evil darkies (that live solely in your imagination), but global economic factors, cheaper foreign imports, massive job losses, endemic unemployment and poverty, and the large-scale failure of a city almost entirely reliant upon one single industry.  But that takes effort to understand.  Why bother when you can just have a knee-jerk reaction and blame it on someone who looks different.

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And there is this soldier who loses his head, then there are protests in some schools from muslisms, that white kids should not be allowed.

And how many of them were immigrants?  Did you check?  Do you want to do so now, and get back to me?

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Things are currently quite better.

You're glowing proof prejudice is dead in Poland. Congratulations.

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#18 Space Voyager

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Posted 30 December 2015 - 07:53 PM

The latest on the issue is Trump's idea to ban all Muslim immigration. I'm not very keen on any religion, yet having it chosen (especially only one of them) as a measure of being allowed to enter the country seems an idea fit for a century or two in the past. Yet he still draws the Republican masses to his side. Any comment?

#19 Hobbes

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Posted 31 December 2015 - 02:48 AM

Guys, I have also engaged myself into heated discussions in the past (I think also with people on this thread) and could I just ask that people actually try to understand what the other person has written? Because I'm reading everyone' comments here and I think you got more in common than what actually separates you, if you want to see it :)

View PostSpace Voyager, on 30 December 2015 - 07:53 PM, said:

The latest on the issue is Trump's idea to ban all Muslim immigration. I'm not very keen on any religion, yet having it chosen (especially only one of them) as a measure of being allowed to enter the country seems an idea fit for a century or two in the past. Yet he still draws the Republican masses to his side. Any comment?

If you know a bit of US history, what he defends isn't new: on the 19th century Catholic immigration was considered a threat, then it was the Chinese, then the Mexicans, and now Muslims because of terrorism. And there's also demographics involved: the so called WASPs (White Anglo-Saxon Protestants) are now less than 50% of the population for the first time in US history, and some of those 'whites' now see themselves threatened since they now are a minority, and most of them vote Republican. (and on a side note, ever since Obama was elected gun purchases in the US have skyrocketed)

What Trump is doing is really to tap into these anxieties and say things that would be unspeakable for nearly all politicians, which cultivates his image as a rogue who hasn't sold itself to Washington politics. And it's like they say: there's no such thing as bad publicity.
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Posted 31 December 2015 - 04:20 AM

View PostSpace Voyager, on 30 December 2015 - 07:53 PM, said:

The latest on the issue is Trump's idea to ban all Muslim immigration. I'm not very keen on any religion, yet having it chosen (especially only one of them) as a measure of being allowed to enter the country seems an idea fit for a century or two in the past. Yet he still draws the Republican masses to his side. Any comment?

I'll comment. The majority of Americans don't hate Muslims. Those that do are basing their decision off of stereotypes which are probably wrong (you don't run into Muslims everyday now do you)? From the few that I have met, they are friendly, hard working folks who are trying to make a decent living for them and their families... much like everyone else. Banning them from entering the country just because a small subset may be ISIS is a knee-jerk overreaction. Immigrants (Muslim or otherwise) should be scrutinized a bit before allowing them into the country for the simple fact of terrorism. Outright bans need to be avoided at all costs because this country was founded on immigrants of all races and religions. It's who we are, like it or not.

Trump creates a lot of waves in order to get a lot of free publicity. He's a loud-mouthed, opinionated, self-centered, opportunist. A schoolyard bully. He'll never become president with this loose cannon behavior (can you imagine... relations with every country will plummet because every time he opens his mouth he spouts some nonsense to anger someone). Right now we need to form alliances with countries to help protect against terrorism, not alienate them.

View PostHobbes, on 31 December 2015 - 02:48 AM, said:

(and on a side note, ever since Obama was elected gun purchases in the US have skyrocketed)

Maybe that's because there are mass shootings every once and a while which frightens the populace into buying guns to protect their children and families from whack-jobs with SMG's? Who is currently president has nothing to do about an increase in gun purchases. Owning guns (any guns) is a right we have granted to us under the second amendment to the Constitution.

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