OFFICIAL Bug thread


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#41 Hobbes

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 03:57 PM

View Postsp1ke, on 23 September 2015 - 03:06 PM, said:

- similarly you can't switch to an agent who has used both actions, even though it would be useful to see the enemies they have spotted and also look out of their eyes

On a PC, place cursor on soldier and click - that should allow you to choose the soldier, even if both actions have been used. You can also use this to deactivate bombs during disposal missions or even switch between a rifle/pistol (and use it to cheat with Squaddie Snipers, by moving, setting overwatch with the pistol and afterwards using this trick to switch back to sniper rifle). This doesn't work on consoles.

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-doesn't seem to be a way to tilt the camera up or down though sometimes it does that by itself as you movemove the camera

There are a couple of mods that allow that.

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-doesn't always reset the roster to the most veterany agents if you have edited the roster. Sometimes it does sometimes it doesn't. Maybe I am missing a subtlety. Maybe it's a feature?

The rooster is a bit of black magic: the two things that influence the position of the soldiers are the number of kills and missions. But I think that the rooster only gets updated right after the mission.

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-Run and Gun doesn't work with the Arc gun. As at least one unlucky Assault agent found out to her butter cost. So yeah that's a feature not a bug too. Just a "surprise". But the game is full of surprises. :-)

The Arc Thrower is considered an 'item' for game proposes.

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- Parking Interceptors over a place has no noticeable effect on Panic. Contrary to the in-game help. So I guess that's flavour text, not a bug? :-)

I just did a quick search through the game files and I can't find anywhere on the tips where this is stated, only "Building satellites is the key to success. Satellites increase your monthly funding and lower panic in Council member countries". Do you have a screenshot or something?
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#42 sp1ke

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 04:09 PM

Naw you're right, there's no mention of a direct connection between Interceptor cover and controlling Panic. Just indirect, as the Satellites control Panic and the Interceptors supposedly protect the Satellites. I must have hallucinated that 'flavour text'. I think I misread the part of the XCom Database called Controlling Panic. Thanks for keeping me honest Hobbes! :-)
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#43 Hobbes

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 04:14 PM

View Postsp1ke, on 23 September 2015 - 03:26 PM, said:

In original XCom, reaction fire does not always trigger even when it is reserved. I believe this game is the same though I may be wrong? I'm pretty sure I've seen agents on overwatch fail to react to something moving through their line of sight. And who's to say that the baddies in the middle of your pack did pass through the lines of sight of the agents who were left on overwatch? And no one can guarantee a pack was protected by a contiguous circular line of sight of overwatch, because the game never shows us its sight arcs, it only ever tells us after the event (movement) when we don't have a line of sight to a particular target or targets.

It's not as the original, where the reactions/TUs of both units where compared, but there is one requirement for Overwatch - it only happens when the spotter sees the movement of an enemy unit in half or zero cover (I can't remember about full cover) for a set amount of distance, usually 2 or 3 tiles.

For instance, if there's a tree which is on the limit of a soldier's sight and there's an unseen alien at the back of the map that moves behind the tree, then your soldier won't fire since it has only spotted the alien when it arrived behind the tree, not during its movement towards the tree. For the soldier to fire on overwatch it would need to be placed one or two tiles forward, where it can see the tiles that the alien will cross before reaching the tree.

This requirement that a soldier/unit needs to see an opponent for a continuous X amount of distance to fire on overwatch has also another consequence - full cover can also 'prevent' overwatch fire if the movement path of the unit causes it passes through high cover that briefly conceals it from enemy sight. This is not something that you (or the aliens) can control (at least easily) to use but that can have quite an effect.

Oh, and just one tip - if you want to enjoy EU2012, don't compare with the original. It was not designed to replicate the original game's mechanics, and what you know about the original will not help you in any way. It's a different approach to a familiar story - you may like the choices or not and compare general parts like the strategic section (which it's much better than the original) or the soldier attachment (works better in EU2012, IMHO), but if you keep comparing and expecting it to be like the original, you'll be disappointed. ;)
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#44 sp1ke

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 04:44 PM

Naw I love it - it's a great take on the original, and the differences and surprises keep me guessing and keep me entertained. So far I have not encountered any deliberate design choice or any deliberate difference with the original that I disagree with. They just seem to have improved it all round. I am really loving it. :-)
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#45 Hobbes

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 05:43 PM

View Postsp1ke, on 23 September 2015 - 04:44 PM, said:

They just seem to have improved it all round. I am really loving it. :-)

Enjoy it while it lasts... I eventually got tired of it, although I don't want to look right now at how many hours I've played it before that happened. :)

Did you go immediately to EW or did are you playing vanilla EU?
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#46 sp1ke

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 06:10 PM

If your assault team is wiped out, the Skyranger evacuates and returns to base empty of soldiers ("Code Black"), which is not unreasonable. However all the weapons and gear that you left on the field appears back at base. This did not happen in Original XCom. In a mission Abort, only the equipment that made it on people's bodies (walking bodies or carried bodies) returned to base stores.

The same thing happens when you Abort in 2012 as when the mission fails - you get all your team's equipment back, not just the equipment of the people who make it to the evac zone.

I suppose we could say that the aliens don't care about the human equipment and they leave it on the site, and the site is secured by local authorities and policed up by XCom operatives in a hasty after-action process.

Edited by sp1ke, 23 September 2015 - 07:43 PM.

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#47 sp1ke

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 07:45 PM

View PostHobbes, on 23 September 2015 - 05:43 PM, said:

Enjoy it while it lasts... I eventually got tired of it, although I don't want to look right now at how many hours I've played it before that happened. Posted Image

Did you go immediately to EW or did are you playing vanilla EU?
I am playing EU I think, and not Second Wave whatever that is. EW is a different option at the startup screen. But I've been playing Ironman since my second game. I really like that feature.
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#48 Hobbes

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Posted 23 September 2015 - 10:36 PM

View Postsp1ke, on 23 September 2015 - 07:45 PM, said:

I am playing EU I think, and not Second Wave whatever that is. EW is a different option at the startup screen. But I've been playing Ironman since my second game. I really like that feature.

Ah nice, EW has some great additions/changes (and others I don't care much) but it's great to start with EU. Second Wave consists of several options that randomize things like stat progression, damage, and others. There's also an option that you lose all the equipment of dead or MIA soldiers.
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#49 NKF

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 07:39 AM

View Postsp1ke, on 23 September 2015 - 03:26 PM, said:

And now a word on baddies teleporting / spawning in the middle of your group. It's worth bearing  in mind that we can do this to the baddies so maybe the game is just being fair and even handed. You can walk one or two or all of your guys into the middle of the baddie pack and they just stand there like lemons, not reacting, because  it's not their turn". So though it seems to break the laws of physics when they do it to us, it's only in the same way that we break the laws of physics when we do it to them.

If they were to physically ran up to you and gun your face off, that's fine. But it's quite another story to start a mission, take a turn or so to move up behind the nearby digger and start peering ahead to see if there are any Mutons around the ditch just ahead, then suddenly a full squad of Mutons are standing amongst your soldiers, do their heroic sprints and blow half your squad away. No initial movement involved - they just appeared out of thin air.

Very late-game X-Com Apocalypse-ish, but experiencing it from the other side. If there were personal teleporters, I'd perhaps be less critical about it. Posted Image

For me, it was such a game breaker for Ironman that I gave up playing that mode.


This is with the unpatched copy of the game. I understand the later releases make the experience a lot less severe.

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#50 sp1ke

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 09:02 AM

View PostNKF, on 24 September 2015 - 07:39 AM, said:

For me, it was such a game breaker for Ironman that I gave up playing that mode.


This is with the unpatched copy of the game. I understand the later releases make the experience a lot less severe.

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Yes that does sound pretty severely unpleasant. I guess as a "late adopter" I have the benefit of playing with a patched and fixed version of the game. So far I have not seen this behaviour (except as a plausible consequence of enemy hidden movement on their turn, same as I can do to them), so perhaps they have fixed it. I see the cinematic teleporting which is actually supposed to be teleporting, and I see spawning in response to my movement / detecting me, which is supposed to be units already present who I couldn't have seen previously. Nothing that appears to break (alien) physics.

However, even in regards the spawning, it has begun to affect my tactics. I never push forward until I have cleared the current area, fully reloaded, regrouped, got into position to repel an attack. Only then will I allow any agent to move forward of our current line of furthest progress - thus triggering the next spawn. OK I suppose you could argue that's not unrealistic. But on the other side of the argument, a special forces team, once engaged, would try to move forward with maximum pace, to deny the enemy time to organise and focus, rather than making a very slow deliberate advance. In XCom 2012 the slow deliberate advance is the only sensible option.

A good fix for this in the game would be to have units spawn over time, regardless of whether you move into them. Once spawned, they could make an AI decision whether to wait in ambush, or attack - or wait until they have overwhelming numbers and rush you. This would assume that the aliens had radios or telepathy or ears or something, and were thus aware that there was an XCom attack in progress. :-)
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#51 sp1ke

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Posted 29 September 2015 - 09:22 AM

So here are a few things I found that were unexpected, not sure if they are bugs or 'features':
  • Arc Throwers don't work on civilians (unlike in Original XCOM where you can stun them for their own protection).
  • Arc Throwers don't work on good guys even if they are Mind Controlled. Again that was a handy thing in Original XCOM to render enemy-controlled agents harmless, without killing them. Also for Panicked agents. I suspect XCOM 2012 will not let me stun a Panicked agent either. Basically you just can never select a human target with the Arc Thrower.
  • You can't attempt to Mind Control an enemy unit that is Mind Controlling one of your units. That doesn't make a lot of sense. So I was about to Mind Control that Ethereal, easily, but I can't do that because he's mind controlling someone else? I don't like that, poor implementation. They just should have said that the targets' Mind Control breaks, if yours succeed. Not made it an Invulnerable to Mind Control power.
  • You can capture alien items by having the alien mind controlled, then killed by the aliens. The items don't explode in this case.
  • However (and again unlike Original XCOM) you can't shoot an alien while it's mind controlled. This makes it hard to dispose of the aliens. You can use indirect fire while they are mind controlled. You can make them drop a grenade on themselves. Or just stand them in the open and set up lots of reaction fire. But it's very dumb that your own guys can't shoot at them just because they are Mind Controlled. Heck I think it would be a big problem the other way round. XCOM agents are trained to shoot aliens on sight so the Psi guy would be saying "hey, stop, stop shooting my alien!". It's not like they put a different coloured team jersey on when they come under Mind Control.

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#52 sp1ke

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Posted 30 September 2015 - 08:54 PM

And wtf is up with save game file management? I can easily spend 15 min trying to find the right save game file, and very easily load the wrong one. No way to name the save file with a helpful description. No way to sort or filter on basic things like Game # or date/time. Files have to be deleted individually and you have to then scroll back through the entire list again each time, it doesn't hold your position in the list. And doesn't allow multiple select for deletion. And if you delete files piecemeal, it becomes even more random to find the right file.

And if you archive off game save files into a subfolder, the game kindly and silently deletes them all at next startup.

This is really, really poor implementation. And a PITA.
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#53 sp1ke

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Posted 01 October 2015 - 02:43 PM

I would say it's a bug that the Mind Shield is described in-game as defensive only. Pretty sure it isn't, if equipped by a Psi Operative it increases their Will for offensive purposes as well as defensive. It's actually more useful to a Psi Operative than Psi Armour.
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#54 sp1ke

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Posted 02 October 2015 - 02:55 PM

Seems to be a bug where, if you use a Medkit to heal a soldier with Poisoning, all soldiers with Poisoning have the Poisoned state cleared, not just the one who was healed.

Unless Poisoning just stops by itself sometimes and this was a random coincidence?
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